1) Cross-Faction Battlegrounds

2) Titles for Honorable Kill amount

3) The option to que as DPS, Healer, Flag-carrier, base-capper, team leader (etc.) in BGs.

4) Give a buff where members of the opposing faction get increased stealth detection 30-45 seconds after a base is capped.

5) Add a section to the site where people can stream all their PvP/PvE gameplay.

6) Bring back BG marks (3 for a win, 1 for a loss) from BGs and give the option to exchange them for items from a custom Darkmoon Faire vendor when the faire comes around once a month.

7) Put PVP off-pieces on the loot table for VoA bosses & "end-boss" bosses in Naxx (KT), OS (Sarth (3D?)) & EoE (Malygos).

8) Scatter 1-3 chest full of PvP goodies around WG. Kind of how the chest in STV works (guru arena).

9) BGs should somehow (I'm relying on Dalaran-wow staff's ingenuity on this one) reward players for actually helping their team as opposed to rewarding based on raw kills (tough one to fix, I know).

10) BGs should be less frustrating to lose. I know the team that wins is the team most "rewarded", but I feel as if some players might feel like they're going the best they can and they get punished for randomly queing with other players who just aren't very good, only qued because someone on global told them to or have terrible gear and die in the blink of an eye.

11) So basically, in PvE you do heroics and get emblems (or shards, can't remember) for every boss kill in the instance. You can even group with your friends and finish most of the dungeons in under 30 minutes. If your friends will carry your new level 80 you can deck him out in reasonably decent gear in a fraction of the time it takes to get anything equivalent in terms of PvP. I do some PvE, and it's infinitely less time consuming to get geared, even some of the most up to date gear. Want some BiS gear? PuG 25 man Malygos and there you go. People in AV on retail would most of the time just ride to the AV boss and kill it anyway. I was thinking that maybe there should be a 10/25 man world boss in WG that dropped items like the ones in VoA or maybe the AV bosses should be buffed by 50% (random #, calm down) and have PvP items on their loot table.

12) You know how players get like 10 potions and a something in the mail when they hit 80? Maybe you could add something to that and give players things at level 10/20/30/40/50/60/70/80 or change the items you get with level 80 and include some Flask of Toughness or a 2vs2/3vs3 charter in there or something.

13) Add herb/mining node spawns in BGs (with increased titanium/frost lotus) spawns scattered around.

14) Add a PvP tabard you can buy that basically acts as a reputation tabard so when you PvP you can get reputation, or when you PvE you can get honor, vice-versa.

15) Guild Wars - Declare war on another guild, PvP-enabled to them at all times!

16) Dishonor Penalties - Dishonor/bounty. Basically, add some sort of Remove honor and give some sort of "rez sickness" when you kill a much lower leveled player.

16A) Apply a debuff or that reduces every stat by 5%/10%/25% for killing a yellow leveled player, green leveled player or gray leveled player for 25 minutes or a buff that increases every stat by 5%/10%/25% for killing a "red" leveled player or "skull" leveled player.

16B) Announce in the zone when someone of a very high level has killed a lower level player which includes their name and coordinates. Sort of like... bounty-hunting.

17) Add outdoor PvP objectives to every zone of Northrend which includes completing quest objectives, maybe looting items from players or "zone-bosses" (which could be a normal mob buffed up by like 300% or something) that drop items you can turn in for certain things.

18) Private Battlegrounds - The option of having a private, passworded battleground to do specific guild-to-guild, or raid-to-raid battles. An easy way around it is to reward little or no honor in these cases.

19) BG Queue Prioritizing - There could be a way to prioritize entering battlegrounds for things like i) Number of BGs done in the last hour; ii) Class need; iii) Groups or; iv) Rank.

20) Account-wide BG Que Persistence - Being able to stay in que while switching to an Alt and leveling. It would be nice to do something productive while waiting for a BG que such as leveling up another character.

21) Removed Opposition Nametags - Give the option to remove your nametag/guild name/title (etc.) from the opposing faction so you won't be seen so easily when ganking around Azeroth. (Kind of the opposite of #16B). Although you can already remove nametags for aesthetics in the options, people might want their own removed so the other faction can't see it.

22) Language - Blizzard has made it clear that players will not be able to speak the languages of the opposing faction but what if, through PvP, you could earn the right to talk cross-faction via say/general chat or something of that sort.

23) Add companions to PvP in general - Add quest to get a (1-5) use item to call out a companion out around your level that specialized in healing/dpsing/crowd-control.

24) Mounted Combat - Being able to fight while mounted would be really fun. But to balance the speed bonus may be very difficult versus anyone unmounted. (Maybe decreasing damage to someone not mounted by 75%). PvP only mounts like the honor ones in Major Cities.

24A) Other mount suggestions include: D. Saddlebags; E. Customizable Mount Graphics; F. Dual-Ridable Mounts (e.g. Two people riding one mount) G. Fighting Mounts & Armor

+1 to both of Joana's suggestions. I would also suggest something like increasing the amount of arena points given per week as someone made a thread about before not being able to acquire all of the gear within a season unless you were very high rated, in relation to this increase the arena points given to be given for a minimum of 1500 rating no matter what rating your team and PR is. Finally I would suggest that PvP either in the form of BGs/WG/Arenas be rewarded with something similar to vote points (or even just vote points) which would allow people to purchase cosmetics and use certain services, to give people more of an incentive to participate.

Edit: and slightly offtopic, some of the suggestions which were given in the exp incentives thread as higher population would likely lead to more participation in PvP

- Free transfers to the faction with less players
- Arena ranking/Honorable kill ranking on the website (make it more noticeable) with rewards to the top players
- PvP Honor system titles http://www.wowwiki.com/Honor_system_(pre-2.0)

First and most important of all, work the better you can with the current resources, so Crossfaction BG is a must first option ToGo. It's not only SAFE but also EASY to apply

Make the server announcer to say as a Global message alert when there are 10min to start Wintergrasp
Then use another global alert, after WG ends to invite everybody to join RBG
Easily, readable information can truly make wonders when treating with public.

Remove Alterac Valley as one of the BG options, as It requires a population we don't have right now.
Keep WSG - Arathi and EotS as the available BGs, as they are fast phased, easy and the favorites of everybody (AV is a massive zerg and SotA is hated by almost every person I know)

This next one is not related to PvP, but overall server population, and I know It's something you guys want to avoid but It's something I needs to happen, atleast, during some time in order to Lure people into the server.

Increase Experience rates to x3 or higher, probably not higher than x5.

I have a good reasoning for this, and It's related to the mindset of the average private server player. You will usually lure a bunch of people if you make things a *bit* easier, as some aspects of the game can't be filled by the nature of a private server. (Example, you want to do a lv 30 dungeon. On retail you have a net of 10.000 players of lv 25-35 on RDF queue. On a private you may have 2 or 3 doing the same)

Experience rates should be raised x3 or even x5, or the (ACTIVE)population won't grow, even will eventually decline.

I still have to see a server with only 1 realm that has x1 rates that becomes POPULAR (It doesn't happen) Just look it from the psycological point of view --

When people are playing a GAME they seek the experiences or results that make them feel REWARDED while they try as hard as they can to avoid those that FRUSTRATE them. All this being done while avoiding the MONOTONY of doing something, otherwise a task designed for fun will become a CHORE and generate FRUSTRATION as it will be percieved as "Something I must do, but I really don't want to anymore" creating negative relations and ideas about said thing on the mind of the individual, eventually drawing them away from the frustration generator, as it is the natural defensive mechanism.

Leveling is a task full of monotony, so anything that alters that pattern (In a positive or negative way) will have a massive impact on the opinion of the individual.

What would be a positive stimule?
1. BG
2. Dungeons
3. Group Questing
4. A rare drop
5. Socialization

Points 1,2,3 basically don't happen unless you have very good luck and find enough people to pull off a dungeon. BGs don't happen.

Point 5 is kind of limited and varies from person to person. A lonely guy maybe wouldn't mind just having Global for chatting. An extrovert person would feel very bad about leveling alone, with no people around, having a chat as dull as global with no guild inviting them, during the 1 week - 2 weeks it takes reaching the level cap.

That only let us Rare drops happening consistently.

Negative ones:
1. Bugged quests
2. Being killed by a higher level character
3. Being unable to do certain things (As they require Dungeons or more than 1 person to do it)
4. Continuity of the monotony.
5. Loneliness

1. It's more likely to happen. Often. On the monotony of leveling, on a x1 rates, where every single quest matters, a bugged quest is a massive let down.
2. Happens not as often, but happens. This is the result of random players being bored by the same reasons and looking for something to do. Like griefing.
3. No population, no changes in the pattern.
4. and 5. These are the most dangerous ones and will draw away anybody in a couple of days, even hours. WoW is a SOCIAL game, designed to be MASSIVELY played. It doesn't work with 2-3 people max per zone at low levels.

Overviewing, negative stimules will happen more often and with more consistency than positive ones, increasing the frustration and eventually making people go away.

All the reasons stated above are the cause most private servers, atleast in their early stages, with low population, have higher leveling rates, so this way, the accumulation of negative impacts from leveling are shortened as much as possible so people actually reach lv 80 with a somewhat positive opinion and do it fast enough to enjoy the content (WHICH IS THE REASON ALGALON EXIST)

You can't treat a private server like you would treat a retail server. Privates have problems retail never had to deal with, like luring people into their servers and making sure they stay.

On retail, you're secured that your time, money and efforts will not be lost. You can enjoy the game as you please with PvP or PvE, basically nullifying the Monotony curve. On a private server, It's a gamble, you don't know if It's going to suck, If its going to have enough population to roll or If its gonna shut down some day. I can assure you more than 1 person has been drawn away instantly by the idea of spending 2 weeks of their time on a server they might not enjoy at all.

Risk/Reward has to be balanced. The reward can't be increased w/o adding custom content, so the Risk should be made lower, by increasing the leveling rates.

^ , Quoting myself from a different thread, my argument is contained there.

And last one, something I would only do myself If my current guild also did it. Enable Faction transfers from Horde to Alliance for FREE during a short period of time. Even add a bonus if a whole guild asks for transfer, like 2500G for each account. This will help balancing the numbers on both sides, right now, as an horde player, Wintergrasp feels as a PvE event where sometimes, a random human warrior with 20 tenacity stacks spawns and is zerg killed by 15 hordes. Pretty sure they aren't having fun that way

@Joana, everything I'm posting is for the sake of having a healthy place to PvP in.

As a long time PvP player myself, having reached +2200 with 2 classes on Retail on 3v3 when I still could pay it, I literally THIRST for PvP and I'm desperate to see some real action happening here. All my points head to increasing the player pool and lure them into PvP activities.

@Jebster, I'm glad my vivid imagination and quick thinking skills have interested you enough to consider them a topic of discussion. If you'd like to provide some helpful information to improve the PvP experience of all those on the server, I encourage you to do so too :D

About WG cannons: Since no one can figure out why they move,remove them permanently but decrease the HP of the vehicles.

Only way how to improve PvP is atracting new players. Not many PvP focused or even normal players are looking for couple of weeks leveling on 1x even tho they would really like to play on this kind of server (progression).

Adding titles or rewards doent really work trust me. I ve played on couple of servers with bad pvp activity and those kind of changes doesnt help.

I will even give you example from this server. DO YOU SEE ANYONE Qing 3v3 FOR RANK 1 TITLE? NO, Most of the current population are not pvpers and they dont give a fuck.

Solution:

You should really consider changing rates or give either instant 70/80. You can keep 1x optional for those who wanna level on 1x.

This would atract much more people and especieally pvpers.

The sooner you realise the better for the server.

Increasing population which is probably the hardest thing to do but at the same time the easiest way to solve the issue.

Make promotions - e.g. this weekend 10x XP/honor/rep boost or free lvl 80 character through RAF program since there are people who wants to play here just can not be bothered with leveling.

Simple and short:

XP Increase something like x3 or x5 or even x7. (Disable or not for those who want to play x1)

Me and my friend are mainly PvP players but are stuck at leveling since it's a pain in the ass to level together because of the amount of bugged quests and respawntimes of mobs and objects which makes it more frustrating to level than it already is.

@Joana some nice suggestions but most of your suggestions were so far from being blizzlike that it's very unlikely to happen. Srsly mining nodes and herbalism in a bg?

Although I like the idea of implementing ranks again. -why did even blizzard removed them? So sad.
But I don't think it would lure more people to play PvP but it would keep it alive for those who want the ranks.


Otherwise just read Quorion post I agree with you 10/10.


Edit: MMR requirements lower for equipment, 2200 mmr in 3v3 is hard because the majority plays 2s only and 3s is rarely played. But that's something to consider later.

I have to agree with everything Sunite said. This server really needs an option of getting instant level 80 charachter (for free) to atract more people here. I really loved the idea of 100% Blizz-like server (and still do) but as it turns out it just doesn't work - I mean in terms of population. Right now the population is decreasing over time (checking that for over 1 month) and that is because of the cursed cycle -> if there is low population it leads to even lower population because people don't find it good enough to play here. I have played on many (free/private) servers so I know how this works.

So the solution would be to make it possible to create level 80 instantly. You might ask then (as well as players) why would people bother with normal leveling? First, because they like the content (that's rare), second - you must motivate them. On Feenix they implemented very nice solution for this. For people who will level up through normal way (from level 1) there is a special reward in form of rare mount (example - celestial steed etc) which can't be achieved any other way. You can also add more rewards like special companions and just anything you find rewarding enough.
I have several friends (from AT server, Feenix, Twinstar etc) who would start playing here right away if they had an option of making instant level 80. And those are not just PvP players, they are interested in progressive PvE realm like this one.

whoa whoa whoa Joanna trying to help with something he knows nothing about, this is new and exciting :D


edit: I think you should allow horde to faction change to ally free for a limited time to try to even out the numbers. I think it would get some more NA players on ally.

Also I know this has been said a million times and it's not very blizzlike but I think xfaction bgs would make a lot of people happy and it would help the community get to know each other.

3x exp wont make much of a different its still lot of leveling and before they hit 80 more ppl will quit

who cares about leveling anyway its 2014 and ppl chase end-game

In case someone do just make an option to level 1x and be my guest

instant 70/80 pros:
-Tons of players
-tons of alts (more HCs, more BGs cus ppl need to gear them)
-actually active arenas
-better competition pve and pvp wise

cons:
-possibly login q
-not being Blizzlike (which clearly doesnt attract enough ppl anyway)

I like the idea of instant leveling, just not 80.

You can pay for 70 right now, and I doubt that you would refund those people if you made it free, but seriously, my entire guild would not be playing here right now if we couldn't have paid for instant 70.

No one likes the idea of voting/donating for gear, but leveling is completely different. This isn't vanilla (although even with the least amount of levels in vanilla I'd argue it still took the longest to level out of all the expansions), so something like instant 60 or instant 70 would be a huge boost.

But, what happens to lower level content? Yeah, it pretty much dies, news flash though, its always dead on private servers anyway, no one is going to waste time doing low level dungeons as everyone just wants to level up to max level. Only if the population of the server was huge would people be doing low level content.

TL;DR Instant 60 or cheaper instant 70, leveling rates to 2x for PRE-WotLK content ONLY, etc.

I find the idea of cross-faction BGs intriguing, and if it's not too much coding I think it's at least worth a try. However I do see one glaring issue with it, as Lanrutcon pointed out:

you can always make a party of 5players and queue together to end up in the same team...but beside that it's totally random...

I think it's possible that cross-faction BGs will push the community toward premade BGs, and then we're right back where we started, because Horde and Alliance wouldn't be able to make premade groups. Just another point to debate on.

XP increase (something like X5) or even instant 70 for free.

Dynamic mmr system like Ravagex said, and probably 2 arena flushes / week.

I would introduce cross faction PvP only for a while until the server gets more of a PvP reputation. After sides get more balanced you can revert to the original blizz faction war. If people make pre-mades then good for them! I say this promotes pvp cooperation at the very least. This doesn't need to be the standard forever just until the server gets more of a pvp community.

Also make it so that an AV or AB doesn't end if enough players are not present. Often the longer BG's tend to end early for the lack of players on one side. If the BG didnt end so quickly because of the unbalance then I think more people have the opportunity to BG.

Another suggestion would be to open up free faction change to the side with less pvp'rs for a while. Or at least make it cheap with vote points.

It has been mentioned here before but I think offer an instant 60 option or give Pre-WotLK content x2 rates.

I disagree with cross-faction battlegrounds. I feel like it sugar-coats the problem, which is imbalanced factions mixed with a low population.

Wintergrasp also has an issue with players not attending. Same with arena.

You all think that x3 exp is not enough but I leveled a char without RaF exp and another oner with RaF exp, the difference is really huge. Having x5 would be too much to have just freely.

I was thinking about letting everyone benefit from the RaF x3 exp instead of just people that has donated for the server.

Another option would be allowing RaF exp from 1-80 instead of 1-60. That would speed leveling way more.

Doing that you keep things blizzlike as possible and also getting new people since they need to be in party and in level range with the other person.

If none of these work , a less blizzlike idea would be letting people to vote or donate ( up to staff) for some EXP tokens, like having x3-x5 exp for a day or two(not many days thou) Thats another incentive to get people to vote and get a bit more of rewards without being game breaking.

These are all options to attract people to play. And thats being said from a person who has many friends that wont play here just for being x1. Im sure theres plenty of people that has friends that thinks like this.

Finally a staff answer! Was looking at this thread every half hour expecting a post.

Good to know you're accepting some of the suggestions, specially the free faction transfer. This may be truly interesting

i have a suggestion

why not make a raid inside a pvp map and calle it a praid with raid bosses patting around killing everyone horde/alliance alike

throw in some dragons too they are cool :)

Thank you for your response Lothloryen. Sadly it is not very comforting. You look at this in avery bad way. Yes, some of the suggestions which you take into acount are nice but they have one huge flaw - they are focused on BALANCING the current POPULATION (such as free faction change) but what the real problem here is that THE POPULATION IS TOo LOW. You want to INCREASE the current POPULATION and then you can think how to balance it, which is much lesser and easier problem to solve.

If you are gonna ignore this fact then more and more people will stop playing here (myself included) and what is it good for that instead of having 100 horde players and 50 alliance players you'll have 75H/75A players? Because 1 month later there'll be 125 players instead of 150. Another month 100 players only and so on. You got the point? The numbers are of course made randomly and but they do reflect reality very well. What you want to do is to increase population first - let's just say you'll make a proper steps and from 200 players the population will raise to 400 players in less than 1 month. 2 month later it will become 600 and the cycle begins.

And here is THE ONLY solution how to achieve that. Make instant level 80 for free. People don't want to pay money for private servers (that's why they are private and not official Blizzard server which are paid for). Yes there is a minority of players (like me) who are willing to pay some money to get the instant 70 level - we are 10% of your potential players here. The rest 90% cba paying.

The sooner you realize this and start acting the higher chance is to "save" this project. You have choice to either stick to your ideals and become another "failed project" (unless you are satisfied with population of less than 200 players) or make the instant level 80 possible and attract more people here.

This project has great potential since it's progressive realm which is very fresh - that makes it attractive for many players. But the are barriers which prevents players from playing here - not being able to have instant level 80. Most of the players just don't want to waste tens of hours played to level up. And most of them don't want to (can't) pay the money to have instant level 70/80.

And here is THE ONLY solution how to achieve that. Make instant level 80 for free

A) they'll never do that
B) I think most players currently playing wouldn't like that

And here is THE ONLY solution how to achieve that. Make instant level 80 for free.

No, this is Wrath, and people should lvl wrath content at least.
A free lvl70 per account would change a lot, or increasing the lvling rates.
But a free lvl80 is quite frankly stupid, and that's coming from me that have been saying in many threads, to increase the lvling rates if you want this server pop to increase.

A instant 70 per account, if you think about it, isn't a bad idea. Why?
- If someone wants to start here, he can experience Wrath content right off the bat, but he still had to spend time for max lvl.

If people want to benefit from BoA gear, and rep enchants etc, then they have to lvl alts on the same account, so you either can create another account, make a lvl70, and grind all the reps on that account again, or lvl 1-70 again, and benefit from what you're main has already done, and the BoA gear you already took.

More alts --> More professions --> more competition on AH --> better prices.

more lvl70-80 --> more Bgs --> more normal dungeons --> more HCs

A) they'll never do that

Who are you? Can you really say NEVER? I dont think so...

B) I think most players currently playing wouldn't like that

I hope they enjoying the server in current state....log in once per week for raids and nothing else to do...

@Jebster (and everyone claiming this argument)

The APPEAL of this server ISN'T the x1 rates (="blizzlike" leveling) but it is actually the progressive system and the scripting of endgame (which makes the server blizzlike).
If you can't understand that I don't know what to do..

Implementing a new queue and invitation selector system so that the battlegrounds have more balanced teams upon starting.

Why? It's called random battleground for a reason: you get random players in a random bg. And what's the point of balance? If I wanted a balanced random BG I'd go play on Hello Kitty MMO where I always win and don't have any frustrations about players being better than me or having a better composition.

Reduce the number of players needed for each battleground, suggestions would be welcome.

This is straight up retarded. Seriously? Why don't we make 2v2 BGs since we're going for full blizzlike experience. Every BG has a minimum players queue requirements; the dimensions of the maps and the objectives are all balanced for the number of players in that BG. If you're going to shrink the maps and change the BG objectives, sure, you can do that, but that's not blizzlike now, isn't it?

Alterac Valley temporary disabled.

I'd accept this only if you give me all the Alterac Valley achievements and exalted reputation.

Free faction change from the most populated faction.

Faction change is only 150 vote points which by gathering those you help out the server by making it more popular and thus increasing the community. If you're lazy and don't want to vote, you can donate 10 euros which is even better. So with both these choices that the players have, why the fuck would you do a free transfer which harms the server more than helping it?

I'm going to say it again, if you want people to do more pvp, you should fix the classes first.
The only suggestion that I find reasonable in this tread is the cross faction BG which will make queues way faster and encourage people on queueing even more often. Currently we get a BG every 2 hours and most of the people don't have that much time to stay online and wait for one to pop up.

Easy there champs, Here how you suppose to fix PvP here.


Restruct the gear of instead of going to Arena is Battleground, Arena is dead , and would be nice if we get more benefits in Battlegrounds.

For All levels except 1-10, Auto-queue for Random BG or low level Warsong Arathi etc etc. Of couse if you dont want to join you leave the battle.

Gank Lowbies because they dont deserve to PvP.

@Clipfer I don't think the population is growing it's more like people come and join to try out the server and the other ones are leaving because they don't have the time or having the fun to level a character from 1-80 again. The population on the alliance side is everytime I check about 150 to 250.

We all expect that the PvP bugs will be fixed soon but I don't think it would lure more people to play PvP but rather make it more viable.
In a BG it's often more buttonsmashing anyways so I don't think that would help the actual problem. Arena is a other story.

Since X-faction bgs will not be implemented the only way to solve the PvP problem is to increase the xp-rate and lure more people to play here. In my point of view the PvP problem isn't even the main problem but rather the population of this server.

I don't really like the idea of 2 arena flushes per week since it's a progressive realm, imagine a high mmr team gets 2 flushes per week, gets their gear faster than anyone else and stomp the other team to the ground because of the gear difference. And sooner or later the PvE community demands 2 ids per week since the PvP players gets 2 flushes per week. It would be more gamebreaking and/or more unblizzlike than a simple xp increase. As already mentioned before reducing the number for a bg is totally rubbish the bgs are ment to play with that amount of players.


A simple xp increase woud help:

- Population growing
- Better economy since more players
- More active PvP
- More attractive to casual player that don't want to invest so much time into leveling
- More competition since more players -> more guilds
- More people to raid Naxx since some players are already BiS and aren't interested in doing naxx again -> helps newcomer so they don't miss the train
- Helps people to get faster to the decisive endgame content
- More people -> more authentic ("blizzlike") when you are surrounded by other players since this game is a mmorpg


And many more arguments.

The only argument I read that are against a xp increase is that it wouldn't feel blizzlike anymore. Ok for those people who want to level with x1 they can simply disable this option then? So every party is satisfied.

If your main goal is to keep it blizzlike as it only can be then the only thing to change is the xp rate since it doesn't have to much impact at all.

a big population is what enables pvp and i think increasing xp rates(x3-x5 seems fair) would be the best way to do that, and from my experience pvpers hate to level so maybe this will attract pvpers aswell

The current population should be more than enough to have decent pvp action going.

I mean think about it.
On the one side, there's like an average of 200 level 80s online, a little more horde but the gap isn't gamebreaking yet.
On the other side, you only need 10 lvl 80s from each faction to get a battleground to pop. 15 from each faction at a maximum given that you don't get warsong gulch.

30 of 200 is what? 15%. We only need 15% of the lvl 80s online to queue to get a bg with our current population.

If you're unsure about my numbers, here is my proof : there are, at this right moment, 70 lvl 80s on alliance and 113 lvl80s on horde. That's 183 players online, eligible for lvl 80 pvp. And yet, not even a single bg poping.
Edit: and let's not even speak of arenas, which only require 2 people per team to queue, they are as unexistant.

Battlegrounds just don't happen. Why? Because the average dalaran-wow player isn't into pvp at all.

So if the staff is looking forward to improve the pvp experience, the solution will not be cross-faction bgs or anything of that kind. If they really want to do something about it, the only solution to the server's problem is to encourage the current players to pvp/increase the number of pvp-oriented players.

How do you encourage people to pvp?
You could push people to pvp by increasing the rewards from it. Maybe increase the honor rate or something, I don't know exactly what would work, or if there's even something that would work for this matter.

But your best bet in my opinion is to try to attract pvp-oriented people.
Now from my experience, the average pvp player doesn't want to spend 7 days of playtime (and that's if he's fast) leveling with x1 rates.
I know this isn't conform to the server ideals to change the xp rates, but face it, you're losing more players than you're gaining by sticking up to these rates.
Then say the pvp player made it to level 80 with x1 xp rates. He's gonna queue into battlegrounds/arenas. And then he notices the serious amount of bugs related to spells/pvp. He probably isn't gonna stay for long.
I know this isn't a thread to report bugs (and I'm not reporting any precisely). But for real, this is one of the reason pvp is/will stay unpopular on this server. The pvp scripts are nowhere near the level of the pve ones.

So yea, that's just my thoughts on what the real issue is.
Jess

+1 to everything Jess said. Another suggestion is to potentially rush RDF, as it speeds up the leveling process in addition to some sort of other exp incentive.

Then say the pvp player made it to level 80 with x1 xp rates. He's gonna queue into battlegrounds/arenas. And then he notices the serious amount of bugs related to spells/pvp. He probably isn't gonna stay for long.
I know this isn't a thread to report bugs (and I'm not reporting any precisely). But for real, this is one of the reason pvp is/will stay unpopular on this server. The pvp scripts are nowhere near the level of the pve ones.

This is the exact reason why my arena partner and I are not currently playing and I bet it is the same reason for plenty of others aswell. My previous post was deleted for saying something similar and I'm not trying to slate the server or anything but this is exactly what I was trying to get across. Especially that last line:

The pvp scripts are nowhere near the level of the pve ones.

- It's so true.

I would agree with what some others have said and scripting a battleground balancing system and removing AV as well as possibly bringing back the PvP titles and script them so you get the titles by reaching certain amount of honorable kills would be a great start.

I don't have much time at the moment to be playing and especially because of the current PvP situation I'm not putting any time into this server (or any WoW servers) at all, but I'm guessing the prices of PvP items hasn't changed yet and according to other peoples calculations it's not possible to obtain every item in 1 season which is something that should be looked into. The current season is already imbalanced because of the extremely low stat gear with regular 3.3.5 patch mechanics. We don't need less stats we need more to make things better!

I just hope a few of these issues can be fixed and hopefully if they are then I'll be back for the furious season (Where hopefully we have enough resilience and other stats to make it a lot less of a zerg fest)

Involve the PvP side of things much more in your next advertisement campaign I'd say! I really can't wait to raid Ulduar and with the better gear and MUCH better raid tier I think population will increase dramatically.

I honestly don't think there is anything to worry about though, I'd bet my left test that the majority of players that are completely inactive are just waiting for the ulduar tier because lets face it, naxx is shit and ulduar is the best raid blizzard ever released. (imo :))

Cheers, Globox

The DF tool was created to solve a similar problem in PVE. The result, players logged in more often to run 5 man dungeons.

The bribery was further increased for needed rolls. Usually a bag with some gold, a gem or two, and vary rarely a mount.

Add the same instant gradification to PvP. A goodie bag. The requirements could be a victory, 3 losses, just participation, etc.

But first fix all spells and abilities. Leveling isn't the problem, boredom at end game is and always will be for Wow. Broken spells just makes PvP unviable atm.

@Damaeg

If they really want to do something about it, the only solution to the server's problem is to encourage the current players to pvp/increase the number of pvp-oriented players.

well, I personally never queued a single BG as of today, for the simple reason that some class mechanics are broken, and things are just way too bursty, with 1vs1 over in less than 15 sec (yes, pvp isn't about 1vs1, but that's not the issue). This dmg, vs this little HP and resilience is absolutely not fun for me personally.

So I think the argument about first bringing real PVP players to the server, instead of trying to make the PVE players PVP is a more valid one.
The balancing will have to be done once more want to pvp.

@Donka

don't really like the idea of 2 arena flushes per week since it's a progressive realm, imagine a high mmr team gets 2 flushes per week, gets their gear faster than anyone else and stomp the other team to the ground because of the gear difference. And sooner or later the PvE community demands 2 ids per week since the PvP players gets 2 flushes per week. It would be more gamebreaking and/or more unblizzlike than a simple xp increase. As already mentioned before reducing the number for a bg is totally rubbish the bgs are ment to play with that amount of players.

I share the same concern. It will only increase the gear difference between people that will make it every single reset and the others.

I think more flushes even at a reduced rate would actually help balance out the gear difference.

Most people who do arena do enough games to get points each flush.

The biggest factor in gear difference is the rating requirement for all the deadly arena and honor pieces.

More games means more rating inflation.

Alternatively you could decrease the arena rating requirements on some of the deadly honor pieces.

The DF tool was created to solve a similar problem in PVE. The result, players logged in more often to run 5 man dungeons.

The bribery was further increased for needed rolls. Usually a bag with some gold, a gem or two, and vary rarely a mount.

This.

This and this.

RDF is a good option, not having it because "It's not blizzlike on this patch umg" sucks.
Sucks a truck. A truck of sock flavored socks.

Hello there,

Thank you very much for your opinions, I am eager to read more.

Okay, as you can probably guess, we do not want cross-faction battlegrounds at all. So, as alternative and with the intentions of reaching a similar effect; I am already working on this:

Implementing a new queue and invitation selector system so that the battlegrounds have more balanced teams upon starting.

Reduce the number of players needed for each battleground, suggestions would be welcome.

Alterac Valley temporary disabled.

Free faction change from the most populated faction.


In the past, the minimum number of players required for each battleground was also reduced, however there was not a proper balancing system implemented. Merging this two features could have really good impact.

I like pretty much the idea of having 2 arena point flushes per week, it could be a great incentive.

About leveling rates and such, we are reading everything carefully but I would like to read more thoughts about this. However, there is still much information to process and think about since we will not break our ideals. We will keep the community informed about it.

Thank you very much, really glad to see the community so participative.

So is there a plan in place to at least implement the free faction change from H>A? I know that my guild plans on xferring as a whole which will bring some active PvPers to alliance side.

are you even aware how amazing Dalaran WoW community is right now and how very much that's connected to 1x rates.

it's not, for almost all hardcore pve players that are here for progression. we are here for the next year or 2. You really think we came and are staying for 4 days played on non max lvl?

anyway,

2. One hour per day every arena game awards a small number of arena points -

bad idea, simply because players are from all around the world, and it wouldn't apply to everyone the same hour, which is just unfair, and no point in doing.

just bring more players !

Increasing the experience rates even by a small amount would bring more players which would = more pvp, I know so many people who unlike me don't have the time the level a toon at 1x who wont play here only because of the experience rates. I doubt there are as many people as you think who care about the leveling part apart from Northrend content the end game is most peoples ultimate goal. I honestly would rather everyone be slightly annoyed that they had to level 1x and new players don't than have the server dieing out as people leave.

Talking with people I know in game, guildmates and even people from other servers, opinions on what may improve this one differ greatly but for one... There is one that is constant, and in my opinion, is very clear it would be the most effective to improving everything.. Increase experience rates, even x2 or x3 would be a massive massive MASSIVE improvement to the server population.

You have to understand many people don't have the time or will to level at x1 on a private server, with some bugged quests and many doubts they can't answer until they are level capped. Being x1 makes these people run away... A lot of people would come if you made the leveling faster, AKA, gave more casual players an easy start.

Please, please, just consider this deeply.

who the fuck cares about leveling !!!

problem is that there is 150 ppl online (46 x level 80) alliance side

If you think that focus of blizzlike server should be on 1x leveling more then having actuall blizzlike end game experience (pvp and pve wise) then you never experienced retail end game.

instant 70/80 otherwise lets enjoy boredom

The DF tool was the single worst addition ever made to WoW (well, that and LFR, which are basically the same thing). It's the very example of short-term gains for long-term loss, and the proof that more convenience doesn't mean better game.

You missed my point entirely. End game PVE players are logging in once/twice a week to raid, not doing instances.

As for raiding, after they have current BiS/bored from the tier they won't log in until Uld is released. Rinse repeat until 3.2 or 3.3

I wasn't even advocating for that anyways. I was using the extra reward system as an example solution to a similar problem now faced by PvP players. Aside from many broken abilities that is.

LFR did ruin the social aspect of the game. However I found the DFT to be quite the opposite. I met many new people and learned a great number of things from them.

LFR did ruin the social aspect of the game. However I found the DFT to be quite the opposite. I met many new people and learned a great number of things from them.

the Dungeon Finder was part of Wrath, people joining here should know this anyway.
The tool itself didn't ruined the social aspect, the cross realm aspect of it did.
If we have it here, you'll meet the exact same people.

If you look at from another aspect btw, people in guilds are running HCs and raids together, and don't interact with anyone else, which may seems like nothing is happening.
The tool will promote more interaction imo, as behaving like a dick will have the same consequences as with a normal group, since we are all from the same server.
So you will likely have more people grouping together that don't know each other, which isn't a bad thing imo.

As for raiding, after they have current BiS/bored from the tier they won't log in until Uld is released. Rinse repeat until 3.2 or 3.3

yes, you know why?
because when you're hardcore, you run every hcs every single day, for 2 weeks, and you got every item you need for MS and OS even.
Then, you only log for raids once a week.

Like I said in other threads, the concepts and expectations of this server are sometimes contradictory.

If you want a server for hardcore PVE end game players then:
- you can't expect everyone of them to play PVP.
- You can't expect them to Pug since they will do guild runs
- You can't expect them to be active when content is cleared.

You want more people and people that play longer, you will need to get more casual players in.

I guess a lot of people don't realize it, you can't have only hardcore players, and players active all the time.

Increasing the xp rate like 3x would still be more blizzlike than some other suggestions or the actions that will be made now.

@rava I don't get your point what you suggest is a paradox? When everyone benefits from it, it would be like the server had 3x.

Again for those people who think that blizzlike is all about leveling with x1 rates the solution for them could be simply by deactivating the "high rates". So every party is pleased.

@Kinwa that's cool but when you dinged 80 there's probably some other guy who leaves by then. People are coming and people are leaving but unfortunately it's on a base of only 400-500 players.

if the pvp continues dead, the population low and changes take too long to happen, i'll end up like the 90% of my guild mates and only log twice per week to get raids done.

dalaran-wow pls

What I wonder, is how exactly increased XP would change anything to the above facts ? If people gets x5 XP rates would they suddendly start to log in more just for... for what ?

No maybe it wouldn't help but the server wouldn't feel dead anymore since more people are joining and gearing up. Maybe it's even more attractive to lvl an alt up. And since this is a thread about a PvP solution many pvp players don't play just to get their points. When the pvp bugs are fixed they'll probably try to push their ratings but at one point, there a just not enough arena teams or you're facing the same team again and again.

@daenes you can't say that. And with x3 rates you still have to spend a lot of time in the char. You don't have any proof for your assertion.
Almost everyday there is this one banned guy who is begging for another chance so your argument for this is wrong. You see apparently they don't care about their char even if they leveled all the way to 80.

Easyrolls? Easily obtainable heirlooms? Please explain this to me since we only want a xp increase not a drop increase.
Do you mean because it's easier to find a group than it is now?

So actually, increased XP rates and RDF could make the situation worse.

I have spoken out several times against increasing XP rates. At least once in this very thread...
Also I never said to bring out DFT now.

Reading Comprehension -1

Any news on when we may see some changes? I just read through the Ulduar advertisement thread and after reading about the projected release time for Uld, if this server doesn't get PvP active or speed up that release it's going to turn into a pretty bad situation IMO.

After thinking this a lot, i know this goes against the standard of progression and what you have been doing as staff, but like i said before: Allowing RaF to everyone since x3 gives a nice boost already , letting it be from 1 to 70 atleast (i would like it till 80 thou). And in top of that enable RDF

Ive seen many people hates RDF, they want to walk to the instance and feel true 3.0 experience and how wow was designed.

But not everyone thinks like that , in fact most of the people outside the server that are not used to play blizzlike realms dont like that and they want to do dungeons as easily as possible while leveling. With the leveling community declining is getting harder to find a group to do a dungeon and also traveling there. Doing a dungeon while leveling is really relaxing and fun, is something that complements the game and the experience which almost everyone who is leveling at the moment is lacking it. It was fine on the release of wotlk since retail had tons of people but we dont here.

So enabling RDF + RaF for everyone before ulduar would encourage more people to level here, and also is more attractive to invite friends to transfer over.

Official thread: A way to improve the PvP experience.

Enable RDF-> PvP Fixed

/applaud

@Sunite So adding instant 80 is the smartest idea /applaud. You joined a server that stated that would never do that and you still claim it.

Since it looks like your brains cant work properly, RDF+RaF for everyone would speed leveling a lot and can be achieved in a week easily without too much burnout. Having RDF would be against their terms of progression , but is less retarded than instant 80.

So if you have nothing coherent to add to the topic please stay away

I guess you only played on servers with 500 pop max so you have no idea how endgame should look like (both PvP and PvE).

All of you thinking that 1x leveling is the CORE of blizzlike you are just stupid. Core and most important thing should be population. With population big enough there is always atleast one BG running, there is always someone in arenas, there is always someone ready to do HCs so when you login whatever you choose to do there are always ppl ready for it.

Atm you log in arenas are dead, for bg there are queued 2 ppl for A and 3 ppl for H what you gonna do? i guess you go offline.

So yeah instant 70/80 seems to be pretty good idea. Anything below 10x doesnt attract much ppl and reasons could be different (leveling is boring, no one cares about leveling but endgame, summer, they have leveled chars on retail already many times, etc. )

Not mentioning summer is here so more ppl will leave then join since there is NOTHING to do just log in once a week to clear PvE content.

People attracted by x10 retarded rates aren't usually the kind of people that make for an interesting community.

This is matter of opinion. Example: for me you are just stupid and not an "interesting community"

What I wonder, is how exactly increased XP would change anything to the above facts ? If people gets x5 XP rates would they suddendly start to log in more just for... for what ?

Why im not surprise that u dont undestand? The fact that it would attrack much more new ppl and suddenly there would be enough ppl for bgs or arenas.

Something that seem to not penetrate the skull of PvPer is simply : plenty of people DON'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT PVP

Then what the FUCK are you doing in topic How to improve PvP experience

Something that seem to not penetrate the skull of your STUPID head is simply : plenty of people DON'T GIVE A SHIT ABOUT LEVELING!!!

If there is 5 people queueing for a BG when there is 70 people lvl 80 online, increased XP won't suddendly make these guy interested in going into BG or arena.

Hmm i wonder why....oh i got it! Because PvPers arent really attract by fact its 1x server. They literally play the game only for arenas. Instant 70/80 would attract those PvPers and boom u got active pvp on server!

Next time please use your brain if you find any before posting thanks.

I see you already implemented a change, you reduced the amount of players required to start a BG and alterac doesn't pop anymore.

I think i've played like 30 bgs this last saturday, It was very active and I enjoyed it a lot. Today Bgs has been down, but I guess it'll continue intermitent as population raises.

Anyway, good change, already noticing it

I did start here just cos progressive server with hope that it would attrack enough ppl. Since i can see that server is dead i would really like an improvement.

On the other hand if you like dead server with 400 population i guess ENJOY!

Then to quote you : what the FUCK are these people doing on a specifically x1 rate server ?

because like said before, lvling is a means to an end. The end being progression content at MAX LVL or progressive pvp at max lvl
the means is a pain in the ass, to arrive at a okish end with the lack of players.

why do you come to a x1 server to then complain about the fact it's x1 ?

he didn't complain, he explained why.
But I guess you would like it better if people complained about 1x Tier Drop on 25man, since that's not Blizzlike. That would legitimate it for you?


Anyway, if things are changed, the Change log "coming this week" that was promised about 1.5 month ago would be nice to have.

Yep, Im with Quorion. I had a good and much PvP this weekend, nice changes Loth, every bg was balanced as far as I saw, the system works very accurately.

How does everyone win.. didn't you think that maybe pvpers want progressive pvp too? (Arena seasons like retail s5-s8)

You have a population on Algalon and a population on Kirin Tor.

Last time I log on KT, I saw FIVE people online, horde side at around 21h ST.
That's a population?
Right now, KT has 4 players online, Algalon 125.

You're forgetting than KT and Algalon don't have the same progression at the moment. Making 1 only for PVP doesn't make much sense, when 1 is on S5, and the other on S8.

KT is really no option. Treating us like scum removing us from Algalon to KT? KT with a population over 10 people? Why is this server still online? Splitting the already low population on Algalon? This is contra productive. And even if they would change the KT server to a PvP server no one would join because there are plenty of server with s8 and an overall better population than KT has.

So really nobody would win.

To all the people who think "Blizzlike" is all about leveling I really don't get your mentality.
You guys are so focused to not change anything. More Blizzlike, more Blizzlike but how comes no one complains about the drop rate? I get so many rares and greens this is not Blizzlike at all.
And how would a xp increase around x2 change what? Can somebody explain this to me?

I saw this weekend like 460 players online from my faction and about 430 from the opposite at the same time (EU), close to 900 players as snapshot is not low population to me. It always can get better, that's for sure. If this changes continue like this past weekend with so many bgs, PvP will be very active.

Already mentioned this kind of population is online once a week just to clear PvE content.

PvP continues to improve, the alliance is finally having the upper hand on the BGs, mostly because of guilds queueing together.

Bg's poped tonight at 11PM (-4GTM) , aka when it was 5AM on EU. I guess more people are going into Bgs (And I'm not even queueing much since I'm busy with an alt)

Overall, good results with your changes.

Well, I get even less the people who try to paint leveling as irrelevant, when it's the basis of the economy and it covers about 90 % of the content of the game. So we're both puzzled :p

what?? that's the economy for you?
about the 90% of the game's content, Well, that's where we differ.
You see is as 90% of the game content, we see it as 10% of our time spent in game.

What people don't want to see is the insane x5 or more increase

x5 is insane for you?
So RaF with rested XP, is 1.5x x2(rested) 3x, that's also almost insane right? put BoA gear and you get almost 4x. So it's already insane!

Yet, the tool, even if made more accessible now, is too restrictive in its use IMO, and only a restricted about of people will want to try it out.
Out of those people, many had problems already, and quickly see the limitations of such a tool.

My point of view on all of this:
PVP and PVE are related. improving 1 will improve the other.
One of the problem I see right now though, is the complete break up between this forum, and what is actually going on in game.

The forum, with no search options, has it's bug tracker linked to KT, the armory linked to KT, the community tab is linked to KT.
Yet, Kirin Tor is completely DEAD. yes DEAD. 4 people online, and not 1 single AH post on horde side.

So, you want more people to start here? I think a first step is also to make this forum reflect on the past 3 months changes, where people just left the 1st, for the 2nd, or left all together.

I personally see this forum as a completely different forum server, which I'm not playing.
Update the forum, show us what's happening, show us who is pvping, show us how many BGs per day are poping. That will also attract more people, and make people more active.
The staff has to see that out of their 2 servers, 1 is dead, 1 is alive. I'm sure they know. I'm sure they are working on it. But we have yet to see it.
For all those people that didn't play on KT, this forum which is the first thing people will look before starting here, is completely disconnected from the current situation.

@solow

no one plays on KT and have you thought about the gear difference?

I have this to say. Make Kirin Tor an instant 80 PVP realm, with its own gear progression based on honor and arena points. I don't know if putting out names of other servers is a good idea but, oh well. Molten has done this superbly, in the form of its Frostwolf PVP server, at the time of Wrath of The Lich King. Players were eased in with the first PVP tier of items, and enough gold to buy blues, spells and glyphs. Then, people worked from there. A replication of that experience would be such a draw to the server's population.

Algalon's focus is clearly on PVE, and I can actually appreciate the Blizzlike setting the team is trying to create. I know in time much of the bugs - which cause the experience to become more a grind to 80, than an enjoyable experience - will be ironed out. But for the time being, it's an effort that is unattractive to players wanting that promised progressive experience. It's habit, unfortunately. Many other servers don't hesitate to give the players thousands of gold, ridiculous xp rates and players have gotten used to that. Keep the experience x1, although I do recommend an option for donation for Instant 80.

SAY SOMETHING ! DO SOMETHING FFS !